debate When are domainers/businesses going to recognise the value of these keyword perfect domains?

[interassets]

I'm still utterly amazed that over a year into the new gTLD's, domainers, investors and brands.. still don't see the value in them? Living in the past or what? Who's going to be the brave soul that launches a big marketing campaign with a gTLD, for them all to suddenly become widely recognised as domain names?

It's insane! One of my biggest regrets as a domainer is acquiring art.investments – a keyword perfect domain that absolutely does what it says on the tin... to list it on Flippa with $349 premium listing and for it to only sell for $550! I expected at least $x,xxx+ given the value of the art business (transactions upto $250million/painting.)

But I feel as domainers, we're limiting our own success in these new territories because we aren't willing to gamble in common sense. Staying with .com, .net etc. is playing it safe, but it's short sighted.

Art.investments or artinvestments.com .. which makes more logical sense? Which is easier to remember? Perhaps .com does just now, but the smart domainer predicts future trends.

I really believe in 5-10 years that the gTLD's will be the standard format. People will look at .com,.net etc. like dialing an international dial code every time you phone someone. Shouldn't we be encouraging the use of these domains by pushing them and ditching the fear of the unknown. Come on guys, see the future!

What's your thoughts?

(Disclaimer: Yes, I have crazy.discount for sale just now, and yes this post is out of rage at the $11 price it's sitting at. A beautiful, memorable and brandable domain for $11..! However, this a real post looking for real discussion on the subject. )

 

[DomainGist]

The world does know the Dot Com and up until 2 weeks ago it was king. Now here comes Google with a 1 BILLION dollar investment in SpaceX project. Now they purchase the Dot .App extension which only means a brand new internet followed by a new king of the hill.
The Pioneer of science Gene Roddenberry predicted the future years before must of us where born. The days of the Dot Com are surely coming to a end and you'll be able to buy them at your local .99 cent store next to Lp's, cassette tapes and cd's.
Dot App browser will be installed in every known to man by default and as they would say on Star Trek... Resistance is futile!
Every other extension will fall to the garbage can. IMO

Sorry I'm confused, what does the SpaceX programme have to do with .app domains?

 

[siron]

Buyer beware. Unless you intend a quick flip, you need to research a registry just as you would if you were buying stocks.

Very true, and very wise comment! New gTLD registry operators are all kinds.
There are several kind of nTLD operators.
There are the reckless businessmen who over spend and take on too many investors, all the way diluting the company with debt, and who don't care about the long term life span of the new gTLD, and so you shouldn't either.
There are also the large portfolio nTLDs, where one TLD is no different than another....because the same story resides at the shared registry. Most marketing is simply on choice and new gTLDs in general.

Then there are also new gTLD registries run by niche and small business people, who may not even be from the domain or registry industry but rather if they are from the niche market that their nTLD caters to. IMHO they have more knowledge about their end user customer than any of those other registry operators and they are more willing to do what ever it takes to serve their market and their new business. What I like the most about these niche operators is that they understand the importance of marketing and investing in the future of the new gTLD because it is their small business.

 

[carob]

I don't care which gTLD I buy as long as the word to the left of the dot goes very well with the word to the right of the dot. Each gTLD have a very limited number of these "big winners".

Precisely.

To be financially viable an extension has to maintain enough registrations and renewals of ordinary domains.

 

[carob]

Then there are also new gTLD registries run by niche and small business people, who may not even be from the domain or registry industry but rather if they are from the niche market that their nTLD caters to. IMHO they have more knowledge about their end user customer than any of those other registry operators and they are more willing to do what ever it takes to serve their market and their new business. What I like the most about these niche operators is that they understand the importance of marketing and investing in the future of the new gTLD because it is their small business.

This is interesting - any examples?

IMO a registry needs serious promotion to have any chance of success. Look at club. A well-run geo extension could have a chance imo.

Remember when Godaddy promoted each new or repurposed extension, one at a time? .name, .asia, .me, .ws, .mobi. .That won't happen now. And .mobi failed financially anyway, despite huge promotion, huge premium auctions, and big backers. Anyone can fail.

 

[ealfert]

To be financially viable an extension has to maintain enough registrations and renewals of ordinary domains.

And .mobi failed financially anyway, despite huge promotion, huge premium auctions, and big backers. Anyone can fail.

It does not matter to registrants of .mobi that the .mobi TLD failed financially and was sold at a huge loss to Afilias. The .mobi TLD is still in existence; individual .mobi registrants did not see their domains disappear. There wasn't even an interruption of services.

The same will happen with new gTLD that are not financially viable. The individual registries may lose money, may sell at a loss, or may go bankrupt. But like any company that goes bankrupt, their assets are sold to pay creditors; even if creditors only get pennies on the dollar or even nothing (after lawyer fees, government owed taxes, etc.). But ICANN will just transfer control to another registry. ICANN can even give the TLD away for free and wave annual fees so that registrants of individual domains are not impacted.

 

[gpmgroup]

ICANN can even give the TLD away for free and wave annual fees so that registrants of individual domains are not impacted.

I wouldn't rely on ICANN saving a TLD that no other registry sees as viatble

 

[ealfert]

I wouldn't rely on ICANN saving a TLD that no other registry sees as viatble

ICANN is a non-profit tasked with making sure Internet runs smoothly. They have more income than expenses. There is absolutely no reason they cannot waive the $25,000 yearly TLD fee. That amount is absolutely meaningless to them. You can see their financials at ...
https://www.icann.org/resources/pages/governance/financials-en

 

[S-B]

ICANN is a non-profit tasked with making sure Internet runs smoothly. They have more income than expenses. There is absolutely no reason they cannot waive the $25,000 yearly TLD fee. That amount is absolutely meaningless to them. You can see their financials at ...
https://www.icann.org/resources/pages/governance/financials-en

There is a fundamental flaw in your logic... Non-profits still are businesses. They need to turn a profit otherwise they will go out of business.

 

[mhdoc]

The difference between a for profit and a non-profit is that the non-profit doesn't pay dividends. Running a non-profit with "generous" salaries and benefits for the founders on a classic low visibility way to get rich.

 

[ealfert]

There is a fundamental flaw in your logic... Non-profits still are businesses. They need to turn a profit otherwise they will go out of business.

ICANN will receive $20 Million more than expenses in 2015. See https://www.icann.org/en/system/files/files/adopted-opplan-budget-fy15-01dec14-en.pdf

It costs ICANN $0 to allow another registry to take over the back-end operations of the TLD. In fact, a reduction in number of registries probably saves them lots of paperwork, time, and money coordinating things.

 

[S-B]

ICANN will receive $20 Million more than expenses in 2015. See https://www.icann.org/en/system/files/files/adopted-opplan-budget-fy15-01dec14-en.pdf

It costs ICANN $0 to allow another registry to take over the back-end operations of the TLD. In fact, a reduction in number of registries probably saves them lots of paperwork, time, and money coordinating things.

$20 million really isn't that much. At the end of the day, there really isn't a reason for them to support failing businesses. This isn't a "too big to fail" situation.

 

[ealfert]

there really isn't a reason for them to support failing businesses

My point is they aren't supporting failing businesses because it cost them nothing to say someone else can take over the TLD at no cost. If the TLD did or did not exist it cost them the same amount of money either way. $0 for existing and $0 for not existing is the same amount.

 

[siron]

This is interesting - any examples?

IMO a registry needs serious promotion to have any chance of success. Look at club. A well-run geo extension could have a chance imo.

Remember when Godaddy promoted each new or repurposed extension, one at a time? .name, .asia, .me, .ws, .mobi. .That won't happen now. And .mobi failed financially anyway, despite huge promotion, huge premium auctions, and big backers. Anyone can fail.

I don't see a new TLD going under. Ealfert is right - just like the .mobi example ICANN will keep the DNS running smoothly for all domain names that are registered.

But if you own a bunch of names and the registry business fails then you are on your own to promote your site or name. No one else is going to market your extension. Right now those .club folks do a ton of marketing and that makes all .club names "cool". .mobi doesn't seem so cool to me.

I liked carobs comment to research the heck out of the new registries and the business people behind them.
Some registries are going to succeed and some will fail.....that's part of the excitement for me; trying to make the smart choice.

Geo TLD'S always have something to do with the local government. I think the main thing is the government gets revenue from the registry. Governments have the power to make sure that the the tlds are used...but rarely does a government run department reach greatness in anything. Bureaucrats and civil servants are never really part of anyones 'A Squad' so to speak. Now If the government subcontracts out the marketing and the business then it could work. I for one have little faith in this occurring.

Personally, I'm look for the business man or team behind a new TLD who is crazy about their space or their market of customers and smart enough to be in it for the long haul. As well as a team with the means to continuously and relentlessly market their nTLD to all user groups.

 

[ealfert]

Okay, found the "ICANN Registry Failover Plan" that gets triggered during critical technical issues as well as business issues such as bankruptcy, insolvency, etc....

https://www.icann.org/en/system/files/files/icann-registry-failover-plan-15jul08-en.pdf

Their top priorities are...

"The overall goals of ICANN’s gTLD Registry Failover Plan are 1) the protection of registrants and 2) to ensure confidence in the DNS."

So, they have plans in place to make sure domain registrants are not affected by registry failures.

 

[iowadawg]

Well, again people for and agin a business they do not own, invest in, or have a thing to do with.
Funny aint it?

 

[equity78]

Michael Berkens has told me repeatedly there are several "Vulture Funds" waiting on the sidelines, if a string were looking to sell.

Besides that a failing registry could be given to someone well heeled like Radix or Donuts for free, they just plug them into their systems.

ICANN will make sure something gets done if a company running a registry is not doing well or wants out. They all had to put up 3 years operating expenses at the beginning as well, not just $185,000.

 

[carob]

ICANN will make sure something gets done if a company running a registry is not doing well or wants out. They all had to put up 3 years operating expenses at the beginning as well, not just $185,000.

I think there is a 3 year continuity requirement - I don't think it extends beyond 3 years, but worth checking.

Of course someone running, or taking over, a registry with too small a pool of registrants is free to increase renewal costs enormously. If you have built a site on the domain you'd lose all your links if you dropped or lost the domain.

 

[equity78]

I think there is a 3 year continuity requirement - I don't think it extends beyond 3 years, but worth checking.

Of course someone running, or taking over, a registry with too small a pool of registrants is free to increase renewal costs enormously. If you have built a site on the domain you'd lose all your links if you dropped or lost the domain.

Right after the first three years all bets are off, so then you would need some other contingency plan if they could not make it.

 

[siron]

I think there is a 3 year continuity requirement - I don't think it extends beyond 3 years, but worth checking.

Of course someone running, or taking over, a registry with too small a pool of registrants is free to increase renewal costs enormously. If you have built a site on the domain you'd lose all your links if you dropped or lost the domain.

Possibly. But registrars might not renew contracts with registries if the prices are ridiculous.

 

[Electric-Shadow]

I think a lot of businesses just don't realize the range of new gTLD's that are available, that or they just don't take them seriously enough and see them as expensive gimmicks. There needs to be better marketing as was mentioned above. Something which registry operators almost always seem to flop at.

 

[Kate]

Continue to fool yourself that the Dot Com will be king forever.

Even a heavyweight like Google does not succeed at everything they do. They have their share of flops and retired projects.
Google was a .mobi backer too... just saying.

What I think about .com does not matter, it's the reality that counts. Not opinions. The figures tell us that .com has grown as much as all new extensions combined (in spite of zone stuffing and cheating). Adoption of new TLDs by end users is nowhere. Not your fault, but that's the way it is.

Sure, the hopers will say "give it some more time" but it's been a year already. What makes you think the next 4 years are going to be drastically different ?

The Pioneer of science Gene Roddenberry predicted the future years before must of us where born. The days of the Dot Com are surely coming to a end and you'll be able to buy them at your local .99 cent store next to Lp's, cassette tapes and cd's.

You are falling for the trap too. Technological advances don't have much of an impact on Internet infrastructure. The Internet is based on protocols and technologies that are awfully stable. Consider E-mail, HTTP, TCP-IP: 20-year old, 30-year old, 40-year old technologies. Yep, HTTP 2.0 is coming.

Some were speculating that online video would translate into increased demand for .tv domains, which obviously isn't true. Just like the shift to mobile Internet didn't create an ecosystem for .mobi. We are still using plain old .com and ccTLDs.
Music has been consumed through different mediums such as audio cassettes, DVD, Blueray or MP3. I can still go to Amazon.com to buy music.

If anything, some of the new extensions will have a short existence and should deserve a museum of their own.

 

[mhdoc]

I notice the internet marketing guys are using longer and longer URLs for their products. Four words is pretty common these days. They are always dot coms though.

 

[drissesco]

I agree that .com will remain king... However as someone that has contact with a huge number of small and medium sized businesses in a b2b capacity, I am noticing more and more businesses opting for new extensions.

Not saying it's a huge trend... and it's definitely not anything to make your heart beat faster or make you get sweaty palms thinking about a payday... But more and more, I'm seeing updated contact info with email addresses changing from gmail, sbcglobal and other assorted generic accounts to domains with the new gtlds... Admittedly these contacts tend to more internet aware, but it is a start.

 

[onebrand.co]

So are new gTLDs:

White and Gold? or Black and Blue?

 

[drissesco]

A couple gtlds include .nyc and .vegas for businesses in those respective cities... I'm noticing use of email addresses not websites...