Domain Empire

What's going on with Epik and Rob Monster?

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I'm catching the tail end of this, seems to be some kind of controversy...

https://domaingang.com/domain-news/rob-monster-off-twitter-after-christchurch-massacre-controversy/

Must be something odd to evoke this type of a response from one of our members.

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The views expressed on this page by users and staff are their own, not those of NamePros.
The following are my personal thoughts on this...obviously no one has to agree with any of them.

Let me first say this clearly. The New Zealand shooting has an atrocity and my heart goes out to all of those who have had their lives impacted. As a society we should do nothing to give oxygen to hateful views such as those of the alleged shooter, and I support the Prime Ministers decision to never utter his name and efforts to make sure his manifesto and video are not distributed. I applaud her governments swift action to make the instruments of such atrocity less accessible. I am touched by those of all religions who have reached out to comfort the survivors and the families of the deceased. It was not a hoax and to say so is simply wrong, no matter who you are.

But this thread is, fundamentally, about @Rob Monster and Epik. I got to know Rob first through NPs and found him a knowledgeable and helpful and respectful presence. I was particularly impressed by the many times he reached out to help individuals who were stressed over some situation, even though there seemed little or no possible payback to Epik. I also respected that he treated those with few friends here just as though they were a VIP with a high value portfolio.

On the opening day of NamesCon I sat down with Rob for the better part of an hour in an interview that I had requested for a future article on Epik and it's CEO. For a variety of reasons, mainly my own procrastination, that article has not yet been written, and doing so now is clearly more challenging. Rob and I talked about his personal beliefs and story, Epik's development, lifetime registrations, innovative plans on the horizon and more. We did talk a bit about due process, deplatforming, and freedom of speech, but that was not the main focus I wanted.

The smart, generous and kind person I had expected from online contact was confirmed in my mind. Rob genuinely cares about people. In fact one of my strongest impressions from that hour was that Rob started it by wanting to talk about me. Rob is a caring person. I saw nothing that would suggest to me any racist opinions or hatred, in fact just the opposite. Those who have tried to paint him that way are wrong in my opinion. As @Ategy.com has related in his detailed and well expressed posts in this thread, Rob Monster even when his views are quite different, respects differences. My political views are undoubtedly very distant from his, but he seemed to genuinely respect that.

I have not seen the post that created this controversy (other than as screen captures shared). If it is true that it offered a link to the 'manifesto' and the video, and that it implied that some aspects of the video might suggest the event did not really happen, then I condemn the post.

There are valid reasons that some need access to documents such as this. Obviously law enforcement, the court system, victim advocacy professionals, researchers in racism and anti-social violence, etc. need access to the document. For me, freedom of speech does not mean anyone who wants it should have access to those documents. While I support Epik's stand on the need for due process in deciding issues such as deplatforming, that is not to say, in my opinion, that anything anyone posts has the right to be seen by anyone.

As it turns out when all of this happened I was reading a book by Dr. Julia Shaw. Early in it she asks the reader to do the following exercise. Think about the worst thing you personally did in your life? Maybe just once you bullied someone, but it was a really weak person in a tough time in life. Maybe just once you stole something and never got caught. Maybe you cheated on your taxes. Maybe you treated a mentally fragile person harshly. Maybe it is something worse. Would you want forever for people to in a black and white way know you always and forever as the bully, cheat, thief, etc., rather than the complex person, with good traits and faults, that you are?

Now I accept that people who I respect, like Shane, feel that a line has been crossed here and have called for Epik to pay the ultimate price. While I do not agree, I understand and respect his view and those who have supported him.

I thank @Slanted for his long posts here, and at Shane's blog, for giving us a glimpse into the situations that probably helped to contribute to the unfortunate response. I disagree with those who say it is irrelevant and simply an excuse. In difficult and stressful times knowing context helps.

Frankly, I find it hard to believe how smart people can come to believe in complex and unrealistic conspiracy scenarios. To some degree I even respect their right to believe crazy things. But only up to the point where their beliefs begin to harm or threaten other people. Parents who went through heartbreak when their children were killed in their school and were then continuously hounded on social media by those who proclaim it did not happen and it was just a staged government to try to take away guns were hurt cruelly. Conspiracy theories are not without consequences. Promoting conspiracy theories hurts real people. Promoting manifestos of shooters makes the world more dangerous.

As wrong as the (apparent) post was, I think it is not fair to Epik and its employees or to Rob to let one tweet (if it was a tweet) forever characterize the man and the company. What I do feel is needed however is the following:
  • A clear statement from Epik that they apologize for the post and recognize how wrong it was.
  • A clear statement from Epik that a post like that will never happen again and procedures to make sure that it will not.
  • A clear statement that while they continue to stand up for due process and freedom of speech, that there are limits on free speech when making items available will extend pain to victims or potentially lead to increased risk. Anyone who has been charged in a violent crime should have everything they wrote archived (in case later found not guilty) in a form that cannot be generally accessed until court proceedings are complete. That would include the writings of all shooters. In other words access to this manifesto and video should immediately cease, if it is still available (I do not know).
  • Some action to mitigate the hurt that was caused by the unfortunate post.
  • Just as the head of Starbucks instituted company wide measures to correct for racial profiling, Epik should commit to measures where specialists help all employees see that free speech can not go so far as to inflict additional pain on sufferers and heighten risk. This is something many organizations, not just Epik, need to take seriously. Epik should refocus to lead responsible freedom of speech, not wide open freedom of speech.
I stopped wearing my Epik cap yesterday. I challenge the company to institute changes so that I can once again proudly wear the cap. Rob and Epik are smart and forward looking and focussed on providing great service and products. Rob is a kind and generous person. I want to see them recover from this. But we must all learn from this.

Bob

That Epik cap must have reminded you of the MAGA cap. You can always see if another registrar sells caps.
 
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I wonder what might a totally free minded AI entity think of situations like this, not an AI that has been developed to carry on and enhance the already existing political, religious, and racial prejudices and agendas of humans, but a truly independent AI entity that has evolved to be a force for good by basing its judgment on logic, compassion, and what is considered to be universal values. It must be very puzzling for such an AI to see that most humans deplore actions based on hate on an Individual level and yet they are part of larger political, religious, and racial groups that collectively promote hate, abuse, torture, and killing all around the globe.

Lets deplore hateful actions (or even hateful speech) that is meant to suppress, torture, and kill others, but lets do it at all levels and not close our eyes to what is being done by people themselves collectively or through their representatives who act on their behalf in the society. Did you vote to take people’s healthcare away or to leave them out on the streets to die by denying them adequate food and shelter, are you part of a group that wants to suppress and humiliate others in to extinction, have you promoted the systematic killing of unborn children through unnecessary abortions, have you allowed people’s lives to be derailed by abuse, delinquency, or drugs while you lived a good life yourself and even benefited from their pain and misery, then don't be surprised when AI holds you responsible for committing crimes against humanity some time soon. IMO

Lets put an end to Hate, but lets end all Hate at all levels.
 
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@Rob Monster may I ask you something... OK - you, both as a CEO and a human being, made some public statement somewhere.

By any chance, before posting online, did you discuss this issue with somebody who also happens to be a part of domaining industry? In a daily chat maybe, discussing latest TV news or anything... And, if so, could it happen that this somebody, being well aware of your controversial personality, somehow provocated you to post what you posted?

A strange question, I understand. What I mean is the following.

I am somewhat fan of conspiracy theories. Right now, the largest domaining forum is busy trying to find out is Rob an angel or a devil.

At the same time, the industry is in danger. We may all need to start looking for new jobs, and soon.

First:

https://domainnamewire.com/2019/03/18/icann-proposes-lifting-price-controls-on-org-info-domains/

https://onlinedomain.com/2019/03/19...price-cap-provisions-on-org-and-info-domains/

For those who are not yet aware, ICANN is "testing waters" trying to lift price controls on .org and .info. So .com will be the next. Want to see your dotcom portfolio registration/renewal fees increasing exponentially? This could soon become a reality, thanks to Verisign lobbying. "Public comment" is open. Anybody commented?

Second:

Escrow.com is now sabotaging Epik in a rather dishonest way. State regulators, instigated by Escrow.com, are now suggesting that all domain marketplaces sales need to be licensed in multiple states. A ridiculous idea, and big news if Escrow.com gets their way. Sedo, Afternic, Uniregistry, BrandBucket – everybody may soon be shut down unless they get licensed as escrow agents. Right now, I'm the guy fighting that fight. If I lose, then we all lose. It's not a small issue for the domain industry.

What a coincidence. Or is it really a coincidence? We may all need to stop domaining and soon, due to either of 2 things above becoming true, and, at the same time, were are spending time and efforts discussing Rob and his personality. Yes, it may well be that Rob is a very bad guy, maybe not, maybe he thinks it was a mistake and/or wiling to clarify his statements, maybe not, but...

from "10 Strategies of Media Control According to Noam Chomsky":

According to Chomsky, the most common of all the strategies of media control is distraction. It basically involves shifting public attention to meaningless or irrelevant things. That’s how they keep our minds occupied. They also overload people with information ... The aim is to make people lose sight of the real problems.

* Avram Noam Chomsky is an American linguist, philosopher, cognitive scientist, historian, political activist, and social critic *
 
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Just as a little offtopic, I am curious that Rob did not register his name yet under rob.monster :) Just came across the .monster tld...

And because he is a personality, at @Uniregistry the name is $11.000 for example. So owner of .monster is speculating... shame on him. This shouldn't be a premium domain, it is a name for God's sake.
 
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I'm catching the tail end of this, seems to be some kind of controversy...

https://domaingang.com/domain-news/rob-monster-off-twitter-after-christchurch-massacre-controversy/

Must be something odd to evoke this type of a response from one of our members.

Show attachment 113030

We are sorry to see this in our industry. Our registry has donated to support the victims of this horrific tragedy, and we are gathering support from others as well.

If you'd like to join us in helping the victims, please visit http://Give.Monster to donate. Thank you for your support.
 
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Just as a little offtopic, I am curious that Rob did not register his name yet under rob.monster :) Just came across the .monster tld...

And because he is a personality, at @Uniregistry the name is $11.000 for example. So owner of .monster is speculating... shame on him. This shouldn't be a premium domain, it is a name for God's sake.
Cookie.monster is worth :$::$::$::$::$::$::$:
 
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How cute.

The XYZ registry with disposable domains creates a "fund" to make fun of the name of the person being accused in this thread, in the form a 301 to the NZ massacre. Lovely.

This is really pretty low, it's one thing to separate the tragedy and create a campaign, which is nice- but then to use the tragedy to trashing the name of your competitor, just shows how stupid some people are.
 
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So @XYZregistry only registered Namepros yesterday to post this ? Reported for flaming, enjoy.
 
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How cute.

The XYZ registry with disposable domains creates a "fund" to make fun of the name of the person being accused in this thread, in the form a 301 to the NZ massacre. Lovely.

This is really pretty low, it's one thing to separate the tragedy and create a campaign, which is nice- but then to use the tragedy to trashing the name of your competitor, just shows how stupid some people are.

Cute. So you registered a domain to "roast" a person and do it in the name of giving......Actually, it's not cute, its disgusting....

So @XYZregistry only registered Namepros yesterday to post this ? Reported for flaming, enjoy.

Yet it seems rather inappropriate in my view.

Brad
 
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For those that find it in their heart to give out of love, here is a direct link. The one provided by the XYZ Registry was done out of hate and intolerance. It was done nefariously, to create harm, while justifying it through giving. It was not done to help the victims. It was done to destroy. The victims of the mass shooting are suffering because of intolerance, when does it end?

Again, here is the direct link:
https://givealittle.co.nz/cause/christchurch-shooting-victims-fund
https://givealittle.co.nz/cause/christchurch-shooting-victims-fund
 
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Cute. So you registered a domain to "roast" a person and do it in the name of giving......Actually, it's not cute, its disgusting....

Yup for a minute I thought it was their fund me page, xyzregistry that is.

I will concur that setting it up under....

If you'd like to join us in helping the victims, please visit http://Give.Monster to donate. Thank you for your support.

.... is in very bad taste
 
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When somebody claims that a mass murder is a hoax when the evidence proves that its not, that person should expect people to be upset or pass judgement like you say.

Of course. And the judgment should be negative.

But it still matters what specifically the negative judgment is. Between "knock it off" and life imprisonment for 3 generations of Rob Monster's family plus all Epik employees plus customers, we have a wide menu of negative judgments to choose from.

For example, 1 reaction would be to say: "Rob, I don't know where you get your news from. But this is not a hoax. You have been misled. And when you share this video publicly you are rubbing salt in the wound of the muslim community. Quit it!"

Another reaction would be: "Rob, you're a neo-Nazi who hates all muslims and celebrates violence. All online platforms should censor you. ICANN should de-accredit Epik as a registrar because of your beliefs. All customers who don't boycott Epik are complicit in murder."

I have seen people impose the 2nd negative judgment. In my opinion, something closer to the first negative judgment is more justifiable as a first response. I personally have gone beyond just that to make lasting change at Epik in this area. But you can see my point, hopefully.
 
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We are sorry to see this in our industry. Our registry has donated to support the victims of this horrific tragedy, and we are gathering support from others as well.

If you'd like to join us in helping the victims, please visit http://Give.Monster to donate. Thank you for your support.


.monster ????

really???????????
 
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Just as a little offtopic, I am curious that Rob did not register his name yet under rob.monster :) Just came across the .monster tld...

It's a little odd (no I'm not crying conspiracy or collusion), that the next post to (see below), made the (see above) off-topic post on topic.
If you'd like to join us in helping the victims, please visit http://Give.Monster to donate. Thank you for your support.

It's even more (what's the word?), that the @XYZregistry is using a .MONSTER domain right now in this thread, given the .MONSTER TLD just entered early access pricing...

Hat Tip: @DomainIncite

http://domainincite.com/24087-xyz-weighs-into-epik-controversy-with-monster-fundraising-domain
XYZ is able to create this domain because it is the registry for .monster, a gTLD it acquired last year that is currently slap-bang in the middle of its early access launch period.
...
And because he is a personality, at @Uniregistry the name is $11.000 for example. So owner of .monster is speculating... shame on him.

The $11,000 figure likely relates to day one of early access pricing:

upload_2019-3-21_16-18-23.png


Daniel Negari, the CEO of .XYZ, even commented on a tweet relating to the aforementioned Rob.Monster domain... https://twitter.com/DanielNegari/status/1105864611612377094

....

Give.Monster registered 2019-03-21T19:31:02.0Z

Is it fair for the registry to register this domain during EAP?

More so, did the registry register Give.Monster, with expectations that the timing would exploit the current situation as PR to generate buzz about their newly entered EAP?

@XYZregistry -- If so, what percentage of the early access proceeds, will y'all be donating to the victims fund?
 
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We are sorry to see this in our industry. Our registry has donated to support the victims of this horrific tragedy, and we are gathering support from others as well.

If you'd like to join us in helping the victims, please visit http://Give.Monster to donate. Thank you for your support.

am i dreaming or is this post for real?
 
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@Rob Monster may I ask you something... OK - you, both as a CEO and a human being, made some public statement somewhere.

By any chance, before posting online, did you discuss this issue with somebody who also happens to be a part of domaining industry? In a daily chat maybe, discussing latest TV news or anything... And, if so, could it happen that this somebody, being well aware of your controversial personality, somehow provocated you to post what you posted?

A strange question, I understand. What I mean is the following.

I am somewhat fan of conspiracy theories. Right now, the largest domaining forum is busy trying to find out is Rob an angel or a devil.

At the same time, the industry is in danger. We may all need to start looking for new jobs, and soon.

First:

https://domainnamewire.com/2019/03/18/icann-proposes-lifting-price-controls-on-org-info-domains/

https://onlinedomain.com/2019/03/19...price-cap-provisions-on-org-and-info-domains/

For those who are not yet aware, ICANN is "testing waters" trying to lift price controls on .org and .info. So .com will be the next. Want to see your dotcom portfolio registration/renewal fees increasing exponentially? This could soon become a reality, thanks to Verisign lobbying. "Public comment" is open. Anybody commented?

Second:



What a coincidence. Or is it really a coincidence? We may all need to stop domaining and soon, due to either of 2 things above becoming true, and, at the same time, were are spending time and efforts discussing Rob and his personality. Yes, it may well be that Rob is a very bad guy, maybe not, maybe he thinks it was a mistake and/or wiling to clarify his statements, maybe not, but...

from "10 Strategies of Media Control According to Noam Chomsky":

According to Chomsky, the most common of all the strategies of media control is distraction. It basically involves shifting public attention to meaningless or irrelevant things. That’s how they keep our minds occupied. They also overload people with information ... The aim is to make people lose sight of the real problems.

* Avram Noam Chomsky is an American linguist, philosopher, cognitive scientist, historian, political activist, and social critic *

lift price controls on .org and .info...as in what we saw done with .co premium pricing?
 
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Nevertheless you spent FAR more time in your very long post praising how wonderful The Monster was and how much you enjoyed his hand holding and friendship than anything else.

Yep, how many posts has @Bob Hawkes now spent praising this guy and telling people to use Epik? He has a bad past in many different ways, give up trying to promote him Bob.
 
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One aspect of this scandal should be addressed: It's about a video.

I haven't seen the video. Because I believe it shows an actual massacre of innocent people, I'm not eager to watch it. Most of you probably feel the same way. Above all, spreading the video for the sake of dismissing what it shows – that seems grotesque and wrong. We recoil instinctively from that idea precisely because we believe it is real footage of people dying.

As a thought experiment, put yourselves in the shoes of someone who believes that the government or the media is fabricating video footage in order to brainwash the general public. If you are this person, then you watch a video believing from the outset that it isn't real – just a hoax with actors of computer generated images (CGI). That makes watching it an innocent fact-finding mission instead of an act of insensitive, cruel voyeurism.

I personally don't care that some people say the video looks fake. Why? Because, given my world view about government and the media, it seems utterly implausible that the video is anything but what it purports to be – a terrible murder scene.

But, again, put yourselves in the shoes of a conspiracy theorist. Believing the government and/or media are faking videos like this for cynical purposes, you watch a video that doesn't look at all like the gory scenes of violence fetishized by Hollywood. Most of us are lucky to have never witnessed a massacre in person. Yet society has portrayed numerous fictional massacres on TV screens and movie theaters. So people have expectations of what violence should look like. A skeptic who looks at real death through a helmet cam might not recognize it for what it is – particularly if their preconceptions are to dismiss the video as a government / media hoax.

To such a conspiracy theorist, it makes perfect sense to ask the general public to view a video of violence that isn't real. It may even seem like an important social service to show them the "truth" about the conspiracy. And it must be infuriating when people refuse to watch the "hoax" video, as those of us do who believe in advance that the video footage is real. To a conspiracy theorist, that unwillingness to watch the video seems like closed-mindedness, as though we have been brainwashed.

Does this excuse the conspiracy theorist from believing in a crazy conspiracy theory? No. Everybody is responsible for choosing reliable news sources and evaluating critically the information they ingest. But a conspiracy theorist who spreads a video like this should be judged with a certain leniency. The goal is not to celebrate murder, after all.

Rob Monster never said people didn't die in the New Zealand massacre. Actually, he told me he believes it happened. However, Rob believed the video footage was edited by someone to capitalize on a "narrative" that served their ends – whatever that means. To my knowledge, Rob has said nothing at all that excuses such a murder.

Yes, I'm aware how crazy this sounds. No, I don't view these conspiracy theories as harmless. Rob is responsible for believing this nonsense, and he should know better.

There is a context for this madness, though. American culture has had an anti-government bias ever since we kicked out the British. At one extreme, the Oklahoma City bomber believed that the country has no legitimate government at all. Conspiracy theories abound. JFK was assassinated by the CIA or whomever. 9/11 was an inside job by the government (so it goes).

There is a deep-seated mistrust of the government and – above all – of the "mainstream media". People on the right in the USA are conditioned to believe the news media lies to them daily. Fox News talks about caravans as invasions, busing illegal immigrants to voting booths, and so forth. From my perspective, it's an endless barrage of conspiracy theories from 1 propagandistic side of the media, trying to discredit any story in the rest of the media.

To varying degrees, something like 40% of the American public believes the media lies to them. And people on the left are prone to this cultural problem too. How many parents don't vaccinate their children, for example?

I'm not excusing any of this. But it has to be seen for what it is – not celebrating the death of muslims but a widespread mistrust (or paranoia, if you like) about the government and the mass media. It seems laughable or tragic to those of us who don't share those assumptions. But it's also worth remembering that the Iraq invasion was based on misinformation from the government and mass media. Some skepticism is warranted. Sometimes skepticism goes into overdrive, and we – as a society – end up with people who believe massacres are hoaxes.

This goes beyond my boss. He is not the only person who falls prey to such tales.
 
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One aspect of this scandal should be addressed: It's about a video.

such a long repetitive text
to explain what?

the german word for the mental state you describe is translated by dict.cc


ADJ
unzurechnungsfähig | [selten]unzurechnungsfähiger | [selten] am unzurechnungsfähigsten bedeppert [ugs.] | behämmert [ugs.] certifiable {adj}
163
unzurechnungsfähig
but_speech.gif
but_info.gif

but_info.gif
but_speech.gif
law(legally) insane {adj} unzurechnungsfähig
but_speech.gif
but_info.gif

but_info.gif
but_speech.gif
mentally incompetent {adj} unzurechnungsfähig
but_speech.gif
but_info.gif

but_info.gif
but_speech.gif
lawnon compos mentis {adj} unzurechnungsfähig
but_speech.gif
but_info.gif

but_info.gif
but_speech.gif
lawof unsound mind {adj} [postpos.] unzurechnungsfähig
but_speech.gif
but_info.gif

but_info.gif
but_speech.gif
lawnot responsible for one's action {adj} unzurechnungsfähig

https://www.dict.cc/?s=unzurechnungsfähig


hopefully you are wrong
 
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I don't have much sympathy for someone who decides to share a video of people getting massacred then implying it was a hoax.

I have only a little sympathy. Such a person is factually wrong. And they're insensitive to the victims and targeted community.

I am sorry but the CEO of a company should really know better. It obviously reflects poorly on the brand.

Yes, it's terrible for branding. Yet at the same time, I see people saying that Rob must have done this to "make money". How? When it is such an unmitigated PR disaster. If Rob had been thinking about making money, then he would have bitten his tongue – as a lot of CEOs with controversial views know to do.

Free Speech" does not mean freedom from consequences when it comes to companies, groups, organizations, etc.

Indeed. This should have been obvious to Rob. Clearly he was naïve in believing that he could express such a controversial view merely as an individual. And his choice to refer to Epik shows how little he understood the public sensibilities or the consequences of his actions. Rob was only thinking of standing up to censorship by republishing banned content. And he was thinking of the small sector of the public that are anti-censorship activisits and who would agree with him.

Rob was in a bubble, an echo chamber. And he was passionate about fighting censorship, come what may. When someone is surrounded by likeminded folks, it is easy to forget that other people will not share the group's views. A CEO of a mainstream company should never forget that their audience is diverse. That's why most CEOs speak publicly only in a way that is bland, neutral, inoffensive, and apolitical. Rob the private citizen forgot the implications of sharing a fringe viewpoint as CEO. And he is learning that lesson the hard way.

If you want to say and do offensive things under the guise of "free speech" then don't be surprised when people are offended by it, and don't be surprised when you lose business because of it.

No kidding. Rob made a mistake. Epik is still a good company, though.
 
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