discuss .desi – the second general availability TLD to possibly shut down

[capybara]

A couple weeks ago I was renewing a bunch of expired domains and my renewal order at Dynadot got stuck with the "pending approval" status. After a few days, it completed however one of the domains didn't renew – that was a .desi domain. I placed an order for it again and got stuck again...messaged the support while googling the issue just in case and found the answer in a DomainNameWire article:

ICANN has placed the top level domain .desi into the Emergency Back-End Registry Operator (EBERO) program.

Earlier this year, TLD operator Desi Networks told ICANN it wanted to terminate its contract for .desi. This was the first company to voluntarily terminate its agreement for a non-brand domain name.

EBERO was set up to ensure domain names still functioned if their registry operators shut down or otherwise didn’t meet their obligations to keep top level domains running.

ICANN said it is seeking a new operator for the top level domain and will issue a request for proposal to find that operator.

There are about 1,900 domains in .desi, but many of them are used for adult content sites. Desi is a term used to refer to people of South Asian birth who live abroad.

The Dynadot support told me while they can't renew the domain, its registration is not going to be cancelled either despite the expiration. So the extension is now in limbo – waiting for some kind of resolution. Apparently there is no precedent for this situation, as it were only the private (brand-owned) TLDs to be cancelled before.

What can be the development on this? Given that the extension failed to gain popularity there might be no other operator willing to pick it up. Will it be maintained by EBERO indefinitely? Or can all the existing registrations get terminated after a while?

Googling the extension (site:.desi) shows only adult content sites living on it, which gives the "shut down" scenario a higher probability as there seems to be no reputable project(s) to go vocal against it.

Also, not unlikely we are going to see more of the unpopular and not profitable gTLD extensions following the same path soon.

 

[Marketer]

Damn! I own icloud.desi

 

[pb]

The first of many, I suppose. It will definitely be an interesting case to watch.

In .pl, when a registrar closes shop, their domains go to a "virtual registry" and you need to pay the renewal directly to the registry, while being actively encouraged to transfer it away. We'll see how it works when the registry closes shop. Maybe ICANN will start collecting fees via EBERO? Probably not, but for sure they won't just let you keep it for free infinitely.

 

[Marketer]

The first of many, I suppose. It will definitely be an interesting case to watch.

In .pl, when a registrar closes shop, their domains go to a "virtual registry" and you need to pay the renewal directly to the registry, while being actively encouraged to transfer it away. We'll see how it works when the registry closes shop. Maybe ICANN will start collecting fees via EBERO? Probably not, but for sure they won't just let you keep it for free infinitely.

Right

 

[USA]

Haha great news.

.desi is a typo if .desiGN?

 

[HotKey]

The beginning of the culling? Unsustainable business model with the new Gs only the strongest will survive.

There was zero reason to have so many released under the ICANN umbrella you have much more than a vision to support the fee's.

 

[jmcc]

It might have been a good idea on paper but the 2012 round of new gTLDs had a lot of people who hadn't a clue about what it takes to make a new TLD successful and they completely underestimated the money required to market a new TLD.

The .WED was an even worse case. It wanted to increase the renewal fee for registrations to a few thousand Dollars after the first or second year. It ended up with 18 domain names in the zone and was in EBERO for years. A lot of the brand gTLDs have also been dropped but they are different to to retail gTLDs. Other new gTLDs had failed but switched to the heavy discounting model to get registrations.

Regards...jmcc

 

[capybara]

The .WED was an even worse case. It wanted to increase the renewal fee for registrations to a few thousand Dollars after the first or second year. It ended up with 18 domain names in the zone and was in EBERO for years.

Oh, so .desi is not the first extension then. Thanks for the information!

There is a bit of info about the process with .wed although not much:
https://www.icann.org/en/blogs/details/next-steps-for-the-wed-generic-top-level-domain-19-5-2021-en

 

[capybara]

Apparently there is no precedent for this situation, as it were only the private (brand-owned) TLDs to be cancelled before.

Thanks to @jmcc we know there is a precedent.
.wed was terminated years ago, yet according to ntldstats.com, there are 35 existing registrations up to date. Googling site:.wed shows several results most of which are the former registry projects but one is a user-operated website.

Interesting what is the sellability status for these domains. If they are going to stay operational for years, not only the existing websites may continue to live, but new ones can emerge as well. Due to the registry limitations (?) these domains are likely not transferrable, but what if they still can be pushed? @Dynadot can you confirm the push situation on .desi domains, is it doable?

 

[Bob Hawkes]

Below is a link to ICANN information on the EBERO process. It guarantees that essential registry operations will be carried out for as long a period as needed, although they also go on to say that in most cases they hope to find a new registry operator within 12 months.

https://www.icann.org/resources/pages/ebero-2013-04-02-en

There are three pre-approved registry operators under the EBERO program, one of which is selected for each case. CIRA (Canadian, although also handle registry operations for some others), Nominet and CNNIC (China).

While it is easy to be critical of ICANN, one important function it insures is emergency and transition processes if a registrar or registry cease to carry out the required functions.

The EBERO was set up when the new gTLD program was introduced, as a safety net should a registry ever cease to operate.

-Bob

 

[bmugford]

While it is easy to be critical of ICANN, one important function it insures is emergency and transition processes if a registrar or registry cease to carry out the required functions.

The EBERO was set up when the new gTLD program was introduced, as a safety net should a registry ever cease to operate.

Yeah, this was an obvious risk at the time.

Many of these applicants had no experience running a registry or in the domain field at all.

Mix that in with awful business models and delusional expectations when it comes to demand...

This type of program was necessary.

Brad

 

[Bob Hawkes]

Nominet was appointed to handle .desi. I had not seen the announcement (just posted today) when I posted earlier. They also were appointed for .wed, the only other new gTLD to go to EBERO procedures.

https://www.nominet.uk/nominet-named-ebero-provider-for-desi-gtld/

By the way, it seems that one can still register .desi, at least when I checked just now at Namecheap it seems it was going to let me. I did not complete purchase, but went into my cart.

-Bob

 

[capybara]

Namecheap it seems it was going to let me. I did not complete purchase, but went into my cart.

Namecheap has been known for allowing all kind of impossible stuff into the cart since forever.

 

[jmcc]

Yeah, this was an obvious risk at the time.

Many of these applicants had no experience running a registry or in the domain field at all.

Mix that in with awful business models and delusional expectations when it comes to demand...

This type of program was necessary.

It was one of the things that ICANN got right on the 2012 round. The problem with the 2012 round was that large-scale Domain Tasting (2005-2008) by a few registrars had created an artificial demand for alternatives. In 2009, large-scale tasting was killed off but the industry had started the process for a new round of gTLDs. The amount of snakeoil sales people claiming to have domain name expertise (registry operations/registrar operations/business models etc) was off the charts. Most of them were complete spoofers and that's putting it very diplomatically. To people who hadn't a clue about the industry, the registry reports on ICANN's site showed the .COM as massively increasing each month with very few deletions. The reports that Verisign was submitting for .COM and .NET were in the old format which meant that the non-grace period deletions (ordinary deletions) were not included. ICANN's own expectations for the first year of the 2012 new gTLDs were not based on reality.

The .DESI had been dead for a few years. It stopped making the current zone file available via the ICANN CZDS a few years ago and didn't reply to access requests. That's generally a bad sign. In addition to the renewals, a registry needs to have new registrations to replace the deletions. A lot of 2012 round gTLDs were not getting enough new registrations to make their operation as a normal gTLD financially viable. They switched to the heavy discounting model which brought in lots of cheap registrations. Most of them would not renew but a small percentage (<5%) would renew at a multiple of the .COM renewal fee. The .DESI didn't do this. Its market was the Indian diaspora and also the Indian market. On paper and to those who hadn't a clue about the domain name business, it was a very large market.

The problem with .DESI's market was that it was not geographically concentrated so each of the countries where it had potential customers needed their own marketing. Marketing is one of the biggest expenses for a new registry and the Field of Dreams business model (build it and they will come) does not work when there is massive competition. The big problem for .DESI was that .IN ccTLD was a competitor as was .COM for the same customers.

The geographic concentration of the markets in a gTLD is not immediately obvious. A gTLD targeting a global market has a set of markets. It has the obvious global market but it also has a set of smaller country level markets. With .COM, the largest of these country level markets is that of the US. This simple fact (that a gTLD is a set of markets rather than a single market) is why Domainers tend to lose money on new gTLDs.

The .WED's problem was its business model ignoring the importance of renewals in a TLD. The .WEDDING gTLD was also launched in the 2012 round and did much better. It had a more typical renewal fee. The .DESI registry seems to have completely underestimated the marketing costs and requirements. All registries can change the registration and renewal fees. Getting the marketing wrong means that prospective registrants don't get to hear about the gTLD. I think that .DESI never quite understood its target market or, more importantly, its competitors.

With a new TLD, it generally takes about three years before it becomes apparent if it will be a small TLD or a largely successful TLD. After the first year's landrush, the second year has the Junk Dump where domain names that could not be flipped or developed are dropped. The third year has the Hold'em or Fold'em event where registrants decide whether it is worth holding on to their registration. Pricewise, the .DESI was caught between the .IN ccTLD and .COM gTLD. With a lot more marketing, it might have been viable but it would have been expensive to get it established as a player.

Regards...jmcc

 

[itssri]

Its market was the Indian diaspora and also the Indian market. On paper and to those who hadn't a clue about the domain name business, it was a very large market.

Right.

Moreover, when coining a non-English term for TLD, the proposers of the TLD should have researched how the target audience would relate to the term. The term "desi" does mean ethnic in a larger sense, but in slang it is a derogatory word meaning an ignoramus!

The big problem for .DESI was that .IN ccTLD was a competitor as was .COM for the same customers.

Even .IN does not have much traction with market in India. It's .COM all the way. People who could not get COM but IN was available would rather not take it, or go for other gTLDs like .NET, .ORG, .INFO or gimmicky TLDs like .BIZ, .IO, .TECH, .ME, .CO, .WS and lately .AI.

DESI was never viable. IMHO, most other ngTLDs are also not viable. Pricing high doesn't work, and discounted pricing will only attract porn, spam and fly-by-night operations.

PS: another "Indian target" TLD that means education but has no takers is .SHIKSHA. The target (educational institutions) would rather go for .AC.IN or .EDU.IN.