This is How I lost my Domain Name at Epik.com

[Fadi H]

Hello everyone,

I've been closing my eyes on many things that I didn't like on Epik.com Registrar. But today is the final day and I'm transferring all my domains from there for a Never comeback.

So what happened is that I had a .CO domain hosted at Epik, Which Expired on December 11th 2021. I did not renew it or transfer it as I've been busy and thought I still have time as I know that .CO domains have a 40 day grace period and that's by the registry. And during that grace period domains are transferable and renewable.

Yesterday I logged in to my account and didn't find the domain, So I clicked the blue button and the support agent said that they will look into the matter and reach back to me later.

Today I received the following response :

"Hello Fadi,

The domain expired on December 11, 2021 and the grace renewal period is 15 days which means that the last day that you have to renew your domain was on December 26, 2021. Since renewal did not take place, and someone had a backorder on your domain, the backorder was fulfilled.

We may be able to get in contact with the new owner to help you get your domain back but you might need to provide your best offer so we can send it to our sales team.

Looking forward hearing from you. "

So I clicked back the blue button questioning about that backorder story and I got the following response :

"Thank you for patiently waiting. I have confirmed with our tech team that domain renewals of 40 day grace period is only applicable for domains without back order. You will only get 15 day grace period if there is a backorder for your domain."

But in fact if you visit Epik.com You will not find this backorder story anywhere on the site.

They referred to this link which doesn't help :

https://www.epik.com/support/faq/expired-registration-recovery-policy/

I'm not satisfied with their answers at all and this is the first time I hear of this 15 day back-order story and it's not even mentioned anywhere on the site.

You can see it clearly "After the discretionary grace period the customer's domain is deleted from their account. And deleted domains may be recoverable for up to a total of 69 days after the expiration date.

Where is the 15 day backorder story?

Your opinions matter, Do you think what they did is right?

 

[iAdam]

The good news is someone will be supporting orphans in Pakistan.

 

[tiletalk]

How is it fair on the person who backordered the domain now that @Rob Monster has cancelled it and put it out to public auction?

As mentioned in second post of this thread, it seems to be pick and choose as you like

 

[Lox]

Yes I didn't renew in time and they have a 15-day grace period that's clear. But what comes after the grace period? The domain gets deleted from my account and still under Epik control and can be recoverable for a higher fee. Nothing mentioned about someone could backorder and win the domain after 15 days of expiration. If you can see it anywhere on Epik, Show me.

You agree (epik.com/registration)... and after, the rest (backorder) is their business.

Regards

 

[branding]

So I skimmed through this thread but for me the big takeaway is that a backorder placed will award you the domain at Epik once it's 15 days after expiration?

Seems kinda odd as usually they claw back your domain after 15 days and try to sell it themselves (through a make offer lander) then send it to snap (? Not sure if they still do), then DD, then fulfilling backorders.

This would make most sense from a business POV, as selling a domain at backorder cost and skipping all steps in between would heavily decrease the opportunity for addional revenue by exploiting the domain expiration process.

What about domains listed on NL? You can list them there up to 15 days after expiration. What happens when you list it and there's a backorder? Will it delist your domain at NL?

@Fadi H

You're sure they sold it to a client who placed a backorder and they not just warehoused it and listed it for sale on their own Landers?

 

[DN Playbook]

What's interesting is how each register differs in policy. Dynadot auctions them off too but when the domain is won they contact the person who let it expire and give them 3 days to renew, but epik just gives them to new buyer. The real thing that makes me wonder is why you didn't get a notice about a backorder but you surely got tons of emails saying to renew

This is my beef with registrars. They should send you notifications on every activity on your domain as long as it is recoverable. To give you every opportunity if there is a change of mind. Many domainers renew on a case per case basis to test domains. However, once expired your domain can go into active auction or be on backorder and you will never know about it, so you can't even bid on your own expired domain. The first registrar to make such notifications and opportunities to the original registrant will definitely differentiate and standout from the pack.

 

[boker]

I may want to add, they've got their fine print covered. It's their right, we all deal with shady registrars at times, it's part of this business.

Point is, when you do, never let your domains expire. There are registrars allowing no grace period at all.

Edit: and obviously the poor customer service. You reached out and and were given a BS story.

The domain isn't on NL, still accepting offers to be accepted by the owner, Epik.

To be honest, 1 day after expiry, I don't think that you can trust 100% any registrar. At namecheap, I was told that they have a standard grace period policy, but that is not guaranteed all the times, so in some particular situations, you could loose your domain even in the first day after expiry. Also, I know plenty of issues when a domain at godaddy could not be transferred away and wasn't visible in the dashboard to manage it, 6 days after expiry( lot's of active domains locked at godaddy for various reasons, even before expiry, so you can't ever be sure).

 

[karmaco]

This is not new and I have to wonder what rock you are living under to not know that Epik has a short renewal period unless you request a longer one. Everyone knows that.

Registrars are allowed to have whatever grace renewal they want. Look it up, no one stole anything from you. You didn’t renew in time.

The incindiary title makes you look bad not Epik. Renew your domains on time next time and know your registrars grace renewal at all times.

 

[Fadi H]

I am not really a fan of the short 15 day grace period, but that apparently is in their TOS.

To say they "stole" your domain though, is hyperbolic IMO.

Brad

Orite I stand back for that statement. But my questions are not yet answered.

 

[Daniel Owens]

Yeah. That is what "in what most cases" would mean...More cases than not, but not all cases.

Maybe Epik should clarify when that would apply, for instance when backorders have been placed.

Brad

Yeah, epik should clarify no doubt but with the verbiage they could not get sued or anything. If it's not recoverable then it's time to move on, I feel sad for him but the only way for OP to get domain back is probably to buy from new owner which is probably not an option.

 

[bmugford]

How is it fair on the person who backordered the domain now that @Rob Monster has cancelled it and put it out to public auction?

As mentioned in second post of this thread, it seems to be pick and choose as you like

I agree with this. You can't really stand by the terms of service when it comes to (15) days, then when there is a backorder just take the domain back after it was fulfilled. How is that fair to the party that played by the rules and backordered the domain?

Brad

 

[Fadi H]

Thanks. That sounds a lot to me like they're blatantly lying. They warehoused the domain and are trying to sell it back to you. No third party involved.

I always try to clean my intention to people, But I also had different possibilities and scenarios running through my mind. The thing is that you can't talk about everything when details are not enough.

Thanks for your input.

 

[Fadi H]

by internal backorder they mean they take possession of the domains and try to sell it themselves.

And I was the first potential buyer, Haha. Even if the internal backorder wasn't mentioned by then.

 

[branding]

You didn't go over the thread else you'd have found your answer.

The support already confirmed that if a backorder is placed, That's 15 days. And if not, Then it can go up to 40 days.

Agreed. Still something to take into consideration, for those dealing with gTLDS/ccTLDS. Some just don't allow a grace period at all, like .eu. you will need to renew before expiration or it'll enter quarantine and needs to be recovered costing you additional fees.

Beyond the scope of this thread I think, at the same time, good opportunity to make people aware the lifecycle of a domain isn't always like you'd expect it to be when you're accustomed to dealing with .coms.

 

[johnn]

This is nothing new to me.
Some people are still in love with them because the pricing but you get what you pay for.
They don't really care about their customers and let personal data exposed to hackers.
Now you know what company you should avoid when you have to register a new name.

 

[Daniel Owens]

The domain was Expired on Dec 11. They fulfilled the backorder on Dec 26 and I reached out to them regarding the matter yesterday.

Of course, Let me remind you what should happen after the 15-day grace period as to what's stated at Epik.

"After the discretionary grace period the customer’s domain is deleted from their account. In most cases, deleted domains may be recoverable for up to a total of 69 days after the expiration date. In the case, where the domain are still eligible to be recovered a restoration fee is assessed."

We are talking about 69 days After December 11th 2021.

As to what's stated at Epik, The scenario that should've happened is that the domain would get deleted from my account but still held at Epik and recoverable.

They've given the domain to someone else who placed a back-order, This process isn't mentioned anywhere and you may refer to their site.


https://www.epik.com/support/faq/expired-registration-recovery-policy/


I think I've already answered this, And their business is also my business as a customer and this backorder process should be clearly stated on their terms. I've only heard of this through their email response that I received today and their live chat.

It said, "In most cases, deleted domains may be recoverable for up to a total of 69 days after the expiration date." So that really covers their behind, notice they say 'in most cases' it can be recoverable', well most does not mean 100% of the time. So that's the loophole for them is that they said "most", if they said always or 100% of the time then you'd have a leg to walk on but the term 'most' means most of the time. So you should have read carefully.

 

[Keith]

Epik has a terrible policy and the owner is even worse. Stay far away from epik.com as they’ll take advantage of customers at any cost.

 

[bmugford]

Did you see what I saw too Mr. ford that it says, "in most cases" and that that doesn't mean it can be recovered 100% of the time?

Yeah. That is what "in what most cases" would mean...More cases than not, but not all cases.

Maybe Epik should clarify when that would apply, for instance when backorders have been placed.

Brad

 

[internext]

i missed that it was backordered away. Sorry

 

[alcy]

Are you saying it's never been done?

that is exactly what I'm saying

if u think billion dollr company have nothing better to.do than sit around watch what u type into searchbar for a stupid 10$ handreg idea then well... i think u are overestimating yerself or underestimating registars hehe

 

[redemo]

that is exactly what I'm saying

if u think billion dollr company have nothing better to.do than sit around watch what u type into searchbar for a stupid 10$ handreg idea then well... i think u are overestimating yerself or underestimating registars hehe

I have no data so it would be pure conjecture without specific examples. This thread was very interesting. I think we learnt three valuable lessons

1. Always read and understand the terms of service.
2. Re-new your domain name in advance of its expiry date.
3. Being kind to others is the way forward for all of us.

On that note I'm going to love you and leave you.

 

[wallet2it]

Ironically this domain was an internal backorder - a domain that was marked to not drop.

If Fadi had been patient and replied in a civil way, he would have gotten the domain back for the cost of the renewal. However, in light of Fadi's approach that was not an option as it rewards thuggery. As I saw it, the charity auction was the next best alternative.

For those unaware, with the expiry stream on Epik, there are 3 paths:

1. The registrant can set the domain to go to NameLiquidate. The owner gets to keep 91% of the auction proceeds. It can be set to go there automatically as a portfolio setting here:

https://registrar.epik.com/account/portfolio-settings/

Show attachment 207094
That is possible up to do day 7 of expiry and then the auction runs 7 days.

2. The registrant can do nothing, and then after the grace period, Epik can elect to warehouse the expired domain. If the domain is not sold, often the former registrant can recover the domain for a $199 fee for up to 1 year. This is entirely at Epik's discretion but has saved many registrants over the years.

3. The registrant can do nothing and the domain will go to Daily Diamonds on the day last day of the expiry delete cycle. There is often good inventory there and the auction runs 24 hours but the registrant does not participate in the auction proceeds as Epik funds the renewal fee during this phase of grace period.

https://www.epik.com/buy/daily-diamonds

Hope that clarifies why the charity auction path was viable, and also why Fadi could have prevailed with just a bit of patience. The object lesson for everyone is to always try the nice guy approach. More generally, smile at the world, and the world smiles back.

Maybe we could all return kindness regardless if others mistreat us. This world would have be better.

 

[Fadi H]

Well, just look at the historical Whois changes. That should give you an idea about the fictional backorder.

They warehoused it. 100%.

I was already looking up Domain IQ. But you can't talk about something if you are not sure. And now we have the internal backorder.

 

[FolioTeam]

After the discretionary grace period the customer’s domain is deleted from their account. In most cases, deleted domains may be recoverable for up to a total of 69 days after the expiration date. In the case, where the domain are still eligible to be recovered a restoration fee is assessed."

This mainly applies to .com. Other extensions' expiry process may differ.

 

[Fadi H]

Yes we can. With the publicly available whois change records they cannot have fulfilled any backorder after the domain expired. It's not rocket science and they know it.

Trust me I was already looking this up. You just went fast on this. But I appreciate your help and input. Thanks.

 

[Fadi H]

This mainly applies to .com. Other extensions' expiry process may differ.

You didn't go over the thread else you'd have found your answer.

The support already confirmed that if a backorder is placed, That's 15 days. And if not, Then it can go up to 40 days.